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Page last updated Thursday, 26 November 2009
The Supreme Court as ruled in favour of the banks which is a bitter blow and disappointment for millions of customers who were expecting billions of pounds in refunds.
In earlier hearings at the High Court, Court of Appeal, the Office of Fair Trading (OFT) won resounding victories but the banks regrouped and lodged a three day appeal in June of this year. As part of their argument they stated that they would receive a ‘deluge of litigation if they lost the final outcome.
It is estimated that the banks earn around £3bn a year from unauthorised over draft charges and with the potential of claims going back as far as July 2001 the loss to the banks would have been enormous.
Where does the OFT go from here?
The ruling stated it can still assess the fairness of charges but under different grounds alternatively the OFT may approach the Competition Commission. The OFT have said they will make a further announcement on this in December.
This is taken from the OFT website;
The OFT is disappointed by today's Supreme Court judgment, which overturns previous High Court and Court of Appeal rulings that unarranged overdraft charging terms can be assessed in full for fairness. It will also be disappointing for many consumers.
The OFT will now consider the detail of this judgment before it makes a decision on whether or not to continue its investigation into unarranged overdraft charging terms. It will also explore with others the implications for consumers and for existing and future legislation and regulation. The OFT expects to make a further announcement in December.
The OFT set out its concerns in relation to unarranged overdraft charges as part of its 2008 market study. This found that banks earn around a third of their retail revenues from unarranged overdraft charges that are difficult to understand, not transparent, and not subject to effective consumer control.
The OFT will be seeking discussions with banks, consumer organisations, the FSA and the Government in the light of this judgment.
Can the OFT appeal against this ruling?
The Court said it would not allow an appeal by the OFT to the European Court of Justice. This also happened to the banks with the Court of Appeal and they subsequently overturned this ruling. So could the OFT do so as well?
What happens to those 1.1 million claims stuck in Court?
This is unclear as there was no specific reference in the judges' ruling as to how the judicial authorities should deal with the frozen cases.
The Courts may wait to see if the OFT challenges bank charges in another way or if they press for a full Competition Commission inquiry.
This should be clearer in December when the OFT will make an announcement but there is a risk that the lower courts may receive directions from the Supreme Court to strike out current claims.
Is there anyway round this by the consumer?
Yes as you may be able to qualify for a refund or a reduction in bank charges if you come under the 'financial hardship' rules.
We have more on this at our Debtwizard guide to financial hardhip rules.
Debtwizard 5 point guide to bank charges following the Supreme Court ruling
Although I very much support the consumer on this, privately I was quite concerned about how the banks could afford to pay out the refunds in the event of them losing this case. Some campaigners have put this amount to be around the £24bn mark as arguably customers could go back in excess of eight years due to the FSA blanket ban of court claims.
It is common knowledge that the banks receive around £3bn income per year from bank overdraft charges and other current accounts so this is a big sum of money to lose.
Furthermore, many consumers have had their credit ratings marked down through missed payments on loans which had the banks lost could have been seen as unlawful. I dread to think of the ensuing litigation.
There is a small chance that the OFT can still do something and I hope they are successful. I expect their lawyers will be scrutinising every word; we will have to wait for an announcement from the OFT next month as to what they plan to do next.
I believe this is actually the beginning of the end of excessive unauthorised overdraft charges as the banks have already started to cut their fees. There will be more competition from the banks which will in turn bring down fees, but to what level?
There will be the odd bank or two that will still try and get away will high charges but if the customer can change banks then this will be the way forward.
Some will claim that the ruling is a good result for the tax payer, especially from those that do not have bank charges to contend with. I understand this to a point but just spare a thought for those who simply cannot get out of the bank charges trap: they are actually funding your so-called free banking, am I right?
I feel it is wrong to expect those that struggle financially to pay for free banking for the better off. I know you will argue that these people need to manage their money properly but most have triggers in their lives that start the debt cycle off such as redundancy, illness or separation. Along comes those dreaded bank charges and for some there is just no escape and they were pinning their hopes on getting these charges back.
Those with bank charges should be refunded with interest back to July 2001 and they should also be offered help and guidance with their finances.
The time has come when bank customers must stop being seen as easy pickings by these institutions. They have vast amounts on money, some of it public funds, which they use to beat down the honest and hard working consumer with.
Debtwizard 5 point guide to bank charges following the Supreme Court ruling
sharon (Guest) Monday, 04 January 2010
I have read all comments and I’m really shocked that every comment is about blaming the bank for missed direct debits and bank charges.
I do agree that bank charges were high, when you have a bank account you simply need to make sure money is in your account to cover payments you have agreed with your providers, these payments come out every month so there shouldn't be any surprises.
I do agree that for some personal circumstances to occur and this should be looked at, lots of people when in this situation let the problem escalate and don't tackle it at the time when the charges just started.
I have had bank accounts for twenty two years and never had a charge and that’s just down to being responsible and paying my bills instead of going out and taking money out of the atm and then realising I have no money to pay my mortgage. If you know you can't afford to pay you direct debits you phone your bank cancel payment and discuss this with your provider to arrange another payment, its not up to the bank to pay them for you.
As for free banking this is a privilege for myself who looks after my account, when you look at countries overseas there is no such thing you have to pay for all your banking and when you don't look after your account they close your account.
I think we are forgetting that the bank is after all a business as well and like every business is there to make a profit, if people were more responsible the bank wouldn't have made such profit.
peter Sunday, 13 December 2009
heard a rumour from within the finance industry that the banks are going to start charging for atm use within months . have you heard anything . i think 14 billion was quoted as available profit to the banks this way.
Debtwizard Friday, 04 December 2009
Hi Nick
Great comment, can't challenge much of what you have said.
You may interested in my blog today http://www.debtwizard.com/blog...lvent-bank
Best wishes
Debtwizard
Nick (Guest) Friday, 04 December 2009
Restructured their charges hey....seems like the banks have come up with another nice little earner. I don't have an overdraft facility. I have a direct debit set up to pay my home insurance (they won't allow payment by other means) and by pure human error did not have enough to cover the cost by 94p.
The bank paid it making me 94p overdrawn and proceeded to charge me £5 a day for their kind act. By the time I recieved the letter informing me of terrible oversight I had been billed £15. Im glad I wasnt away visiting relatives or something or ..well..the maths is easy.
Banks have become a modern day Sheriff of Nottingham and they kill off any Robin Hood that dare stand in their way. They exploit to the hilt the way todays transactions work..ie wages must go into a bank, payments must be by direct debit etc etc. Short of everyone drawing their money out of banks and keeping it that way I can't see anyway of stopping the greed. :(
Debtwizard Thursday, 03 December 2009
Hi Pol
Do you think you may have a claim under the financial hardship' rules. I have more on this here on the link below, I try and give as much info as possible and explain the procedure. The banks have a duty to help you, also see the other article as well.
Financial hardship http://www.debtwizard.com/debt...l-hardship
FOS to stop pussyfooting around with the banks here at http://www.debtwizard.com/news...-the-banks
Best wishes and good luck.
Debtwizard
POL (Guest) Thursday, 03 December 2009
lHAVE BEEN LIVING ON THE BONES OF MY BACKSIDE FOR 2 YEARS, THROUGH NO FAULT OF MY OWN.......I WORK FULL TIME, AND INTEND TO CONTINUE, ABBEY HAVE TREATED ME DISGUSTINGLY, AND REALLY DONT WANT TO LISTEN TO MY PREDICAMENT, I DETEST THE BANK. THEY HAVE NOT ONE OUNCE OF COMPASSION. MY ADVICE TO ANY ONE OUT THERE SUFFERING AT THE HANDS OF THESE BANKS, HAVE FAITH......YOU WILL GET THERE IN THE END.
Red (Guest) Thursday, 03 December 2009
Well, at least with this saving the funds can now be used to pay bonuses for the top bankers. It is all a scam you know it, I know it and they know it! The more money you have they better chances you have at winning. That is well known, so don't be surprised at the outcome. The public always loses!!!!!
shaun (Guest) Monday, 30 November 2009
i have been getting failled direct debit charges for 8 years now starting from £5.00 right up to £35.00 and the bank has taken over £7,000. to date , i started my claim nearly 30 months ago , because of my credit history the halifax never allowed me any overdraught , or cheque book , and only gave me a current acc card , this is why i got in this state they new i was in this mess but never offered me anything and just let me struggle saying i needed to be clear for 12 months without any failled charges , they new my position, i was paying in £1000.00 a month from my wages , but offered me no overdraught to help me , i think its payback time , dont you all think
Debtwizard Monday, 30 November 2009
Hi Gordon
I agree with your comments, this in my view is NOT a clear cut victory for the banks. We need to let the 'legals' do their bit as you say. Thanks for you comment.
Best wishes
Debtwizard
Gordon (Guest) Monday, 30 November 2009
Firstly, i would like to thank the Supreme Judges on the announcement last week. Before you begin cursing at me please let me explain. I believe that this will now be sorted out quicker this way than if the banks had "lost". The Supreme Court have very cleverly worded this in the consumers favour. I believe that if we all sit tight and let the legal people do there job we will all be rejoycing in victory. Watch this space......
Rubes (Guest) Monday, 30 November 2009
The banks have now lowered thier charges...is that an admission of guilt? Also, surely there are competition laws that can be used in consumers favour. If i wanted to move banks, i would look for one that wasnt ripping people off with inflated chrges, BUT, there werent any. If it only cost £5 - £10 to process bounced cheques, etc, how come all banks charged £33 - 35. Were they all working together to keep the price fixed artificially high. Collusion?!
nick (Guest) Thursday, 26 November 2009
hi everyone
I just wanted to say the bank charges are our money in the first place so who's money is it that the banks dont want to pay back.
If i took a loan out and stopped paying the payments that bank will make sure they take away everything that belongs to me untill they have there money back.
thanks very much
Debtwizard Thursday, 26 November 2009
Hi Matt
Really sorry to hear of the hard time you have been having. You could well be a candidate for the 'financial hardship' claim. Have a look and see if this is you, I try and give as much info as possible and explain the procedure. The banks have a duty to help you, also see the other article as well.
Financial hardship http://www.debtwizard.com/debt...l-hardship
FOS to stop pussyfooting around with the banks here at http://www.debtwizard.com/news...-the-banks
Best wishes and good luck.
Debtwizard
ken h (Guest) Thursday, 26 November 2009
i suppose that means the banks can now charge what they like for anything, we will all be broke within a year.
matt f (Guest) Thursday, 26 November 2009
what a load of bull s**t!!!! im sick of this crap where the banks can get a way with this !!! In 2001 I had a new born child and was earning £180 per week ............ well my bank acc when over drawn and I ended up with just shy of £300 charges when I went to the bank and saw the manager he ask why I was overdrawn .. well I explaned to him that I was only earing £180 pee week and my baby had to go in to hospiltal whichh was costing me more money ....... well he said thats not good cos now your going to have a consolidation loan which I have paid back £2168. 21 over 5 years how can this be ............ I had no option new born, rent and counil tax, trying to live, there was days when I did not have anything to eat. This is no joke so I could keep my child warm ... im so pissed off with my old bank now (natwest) so I paid big time.................. how can they get away with this having to take out a loan over 5 years to pay off bank charges ................... sorry about the spelling im just so mad. ps who paid of the hight court judges
Edmund m. (Guest) Thursday, 26 November 2009
work pay tax then you get what ,someone that saying its fine your not getting nothing back. they will NOT get there money back from me............that thay put me in.i was in time early in may when they showed it on ,tv. but they sent my statments in the wrong order then the test case started then said its going to court......Iam pisssed off.
sshfcc (Guest) Wednesday, 25 November 2009
I'm closing my bank accounts and digging a hole in the garden and planting a bush on top. Then I'll know what is mine. Banking sucks
Stevie P (Guest) Wednesday, 25 November 2009
It doesnt come as a surprise abouts todays decision. With all the major banks now being bailed out with taxpayers money and being around 70% owned by the Government if the decision had went in our favour the banks would have to pay us all out with our own public money. If the banks were as financially strong as they were 3 years ago then i have no doubt that todays decision would have went in our favour.
Gemma (Guest) Wednesday, 25 November 2009
What a huge suprise this has come as (not)!
If the banks ridiculous charges weren't unfair then why has my bank reduced the £35 fee for going over your agreed limit to £12??!!!!
As usual the big boys win again. Had a claim on hold myself for a few thousand.
Very disappointed!
mike (Guest) Wednesday, 25 November 2009
what a load of bulls**t. i want my money
Debtwizard Wednesday, 25 November 2009
Hi Peter
I support that, good call.
Best wishes
Debtwizard
Debtwizard Wednesday, 25 November 2009
Hi Peter
I would support that, good point.
Best wishes
Debtwizard
peter Wednesday, 25 November 2009
once again the banks have played the emotional blackmail card. its time for this govt to show some backbone and provide real competition to the banks by allowing full banking status to credit unions then the little people could stop subsidising free banking for the well off.
Debtwizard Wednesday, 25 November 2009
Hi Lotty
Great question!
I covered this today on several of my radio interviews. If a Claims Management Company (CMC) has solely relied upon bank charges claims as their main revenue of income then they are finished.
I can see several of these firms coming unstuck and know of some sitting on what they thought was thousands of pounds in fees.
When I hear more I will post it here.
Best wishes
Debtwizard
lotty (Guest) Wednesday, 25 November 2009
what happens to all the claims on hold now
Caryn (Guest) Wednesday, 25 November 2009
A huge disappointment for me as I had a claim for over £3,000. I agree with comments here - it's a downward spiral for those of us who are struggling financially & get clobbered with bank charges that we can do nothing about. It should not have been allowed to happen in the first place & we're stuck in the same position we seem to always be in : we can't do a darned thing about it!
Colin (Guest) Wednesday, 25 November 2009
I know you're a great champion for the consumer, Mike. That's why I was a bit surprised by the tone perhaps more than the substance. If they had lost the case, no doubt the banks WOULD have been allowed to appeal to the European Court of Justice and drag things out longer. Their current margins are so good at the moment they won't be poor bankers for long and with a government that won't let any of them go under completely even £24 billion refunds wouldn't be a disaster for them (in my opinion!)
Alex (Guest) Wednesday, 25 November 2009
Personally disappointed, as I had a claim that amounted to several thousand pounds in the wings,for overdrawn sums that total less than £300 - how is 1000% interest on small oversights that were always corrected within less than four hours fair?. However that money had already gone, and getting it back would never have been anything more than a bonus.
The big thing here for me is that the judge has also given the banks carte blanche to continue with this racket. Mike may believe that we are approaching the end of unfair charges - personally I disagree. If all the banks stick together as they did in this case, there will be no alternative you can jump ship to if you think your own charges are unfair. Yet again the banks forget that it's not their money they use to make money, it's their customers'.
There are the odd one or two banks who give you a bit of grace - my own bank don't apply any charges if you get back within your limit within 24 hours, but they're quite stringent on who they let have an account in the first place, and they still charge the same £35 fees that others do if the grace period is exceeded (I've never exceeded it, but then if my last bank had a similar ruling, I'd never have incurred any charges in the first placee).
I don't believe we should be allowed to go overdrawn and not incur a charge, but being charged £35 for being overdrawn by less than a pound for a few hours is just ridiculous. What the supreme court have done is told the banks they can continue with this theft, and it is theft - a few pence overdrawn for a few hours can and has in many cases resulted in hundreds of pounds worth of charges.
During the lead up to this judgment, the banks were all going on about how free banking would soon be a thing of the past - the fact that they have won will not chance this. I personally believe that this time in 10 years, there will be charges on all current accounts just for having them in operation, and it wouldn't surprise me if those charges are significantly lower for those who have larger salaries going in.
I'd like to make a few more comments that I suspect would probably get me modded, so I'll part with a final bit of food for thought - what kind of charges and fees did the banks themselves incur when they overstretched themselves and had to be bailed out with taxpayers' money? I can guarantee that it wasn't anything like as much as banks charge their customers if you put it on a relative basis.
This country has become a joke, and a very bad one at that. Rip off Britain? Darned right it is!
Debtwizard Wednesday, 25 November 2009
Hi Colin
I do not have sympathy for the banks and will check my article and comment to make sure there is no mis-understanding. My concern is what this would have done to the banking industry and the economy as there is no money to meet the refunds, it is arguable that this could have finished off a bank or two and the ongoing litigation would be enormous.
I am a little suspicious that others may have thought the same, what with the secret bail out of RBS and HBOS only recently revealed, one never knows what really is going on and whether this had any influence on the decision announced today.
I am still all for the OFT to win and am as shocked as others in light of their successes at the High Court and Appeal Court.
What I try and do is offer a balanced article but most people that know me know that I bat for the consumer. Trust this clarifies the position.
Best wishes
Debtwizard
Allan (Guest) Wednesday, 25 November 2009
The British legal system simply amazes me. If you have enough money and "clout" you can appeal and appeal until the outcome suits you. The "little people" were never ever going to win.
Colin Wednesday, 25 November 2009
I am a bit surprised by your sympathy for the banks, Mike. If a company fleecing old ladies by selling them £1000 vacuum cleaners (they do exist!) were told by a court to refund the money I don't suppose you would worry about how they could afford it! As for the banks, no doubt they already had a contingency for these refunds (they must have been just as surprised to have won) and if all else failed us taxpayers would bail them out again - just this time some of us would have seen some benefit!
Samantha Wednesday, 25 November 2009
so the ruling says the oft has no right to attack the banks charges levied on customers account, which means the customer does have a right to still challenge the banks
Mark Sumpton (Guest) Wednesday, 25 November 2009
It is a absolute disgrace that the normal working person has been stepped on again , by a minority at the Top, playing financial swords with our lives we have has a family had over 4000 pounds worth of charges cleverly siphoned off, by the system that when you are trapped in it, you cant get out unless you have a windfall or a lottery, I am 42 unemployed at the moment, hoping that there would be some kind of sympathetic favour shown to the normal working person by the supreme court judges, what a surprise that was none so the ruling says the oft has no right to attack the banks charging levied on customers account, which means the customer does have a right to challenge the banks in the small claims
Colin Wednesday, 25 November 2009
On what grounds can a court (in this case the Supreme Court) deny an appeal to a higher court? At best this decision is back to square one. More likely, banks will restructure their charges (as they have started to do) with no redress available for past unfair charges. Can't upset the poor bankers, can we? MPs can legislate, of course, but I wouldn't bet on them favouring the public at the expense of the banks. Perhaps someone should tip off Messrs G Brown and A Darling what a shot in the arm to the economy would be the £billion-or-so bank charge refunds in consumers' pockets before the General Election!
Tony (Guest) Wednesday, 25 November 2009
A set back but not yet the end of the road. The banks are in dire straights and will be celebrating this judgement using the money earmarked for refunds! Nothing ventured - nothing gained - I'm sure the millions of consumers wating for their money will keep this one going!
Next step to overturn this judgement via European Courts.
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